topic Re: Ruckus H510 antenna pattern and placement in Wireless Questions and Best Practices

Ruckus H510 antenna pattern and placement

lukas_bohm — Tue, 22 Aug 2017 12:10:21 GMT

Hello all, i got a question about Ruckus H510 wall AP. I found antenna patterns here: https://support.ruckuswireless.com/answers/000002093/download and what isn't clear for me - is antenna pattern for AP mounted on a wall ( as should be ) or on the ceilling.

So if i have this AP on a wall, is behind AP same signal strength ( if i am not considering wall attenuation ) ? Is that antenna pattern for AP mounted on the wall or on the ceiling?

Thanks
Lucas

Re: Ruckus H510 antenna pattern and placement

lukas_bohm — Tue, 22 Aug 2017 13:25:40 GMT

Hello, i found this document: http://www.netadmin.us/docs/Ruckus_Creating_AP_Templates.pdf which says: "This is an Azimuth orientation (hanging
from the ceiling). It is the most commonly used orientation. If you are hanging it on a wall, use
the EL (Elevation) option."

So if H510 is on the wall ( not on the ceiling ) then i need to consider EL antenna patter for on the floor coverage and AZ between the floors coverage? Right?

Can somebody advise me best practice for H510 placement?
They should be on outside walls ( from indoor side of course ). I want to achieve two rooms coverage per 1 AP, 32 in summary.

Thanks a lot

Re: Ruckus H510 antenna pattern and placement

michael_brado — Tue, 22 Aug 2017 23:18:19 GMT

If you put one H510 on the outside wall, near the wall between the two rooms you wish to cover, it should be sufficient.
Alternate and stagger on the other side of the hallway rooms so your H510s are not directly accross from each other.

If you have a copy of ZonePlanner, this antenna pattern KBA has the H510 radiation patterns for 2.4 and 5g, and assumes
the H510 is wall (not ceiling) mounted.
https://support.ruckuswireless.com/answers/000002093

Re: Ruckus H510 antenna pattern and placement

lukas_bohm — Wed, 23 Aug 2017 01:30:24 GMT

Hello Michael,
thank you for your reply. I would like better specify my scenario.

There are two hallways and 8 rooms per hallway, 16 rooms per one floor. One room consists of 2 small rooms divided by wall. All 8 rooms in one hallway are in row, only in one side. It means there aren't rooms from other side of hallway. Same is in second hallway, which are in opposite side of the floor.

Two small rooms share common wall between each other. This wall goes between hallway wall ( between room and hallway ) and outside/outer wall . My plan was put one H510 on this common wall. But i wasn't sure about H510 antenna pattern. If H510 could cover second room behind the common wall.

So if that radiation patterns assume that H510 is really wall mounted, then it covers all in 360 degrees radius in horizontal plane. Right? But if you look at those diagrams, then elevation diagram is strange. It seems that then H510 covers very well upper floor and very slightly or almost not lower floor. Am i right?

Btw: Would be helpful drawing for you?
Unfortunatelly i haven't got ZonePlanner. I use Ekahau.

What is better approach for this project? More H with lower TX gain or fewer R ? I need penertrate max 1 concrete wall. ( unfortunately all walls are made from concrete ).

Thanks

Lucas

Re: Ruckus H510 antenna pattern and placement

michael_brado — Wed, 23 Aug 2017 16:00:25 GMT

Any reason you're not discussing your plans with your local VAR?

Re: Ruckus H510 antenna pattern and placement

lukas_bohm — Tue, 29 Aug 2017 03:53:37 GMT

Hello Michael, thank you for your answer. I am Ruckus Partner ( very small partner with very short partnership - only couple weeks ). I am doing project with H510 's first time, and want best solution for customer. That's why i asked questions about H510 radiation pattern. I asked these questions Ruckus Support, Ruckus Sales Engineers, Ruckus Distributor and here in Ruckus forum. Because it's big difference between H510 on the wall when AZ pattern is for horizontal plane and EL pattern is for vertical plane ( then one AP can cover 360 degrees on one floor, not only room because that AP can then radiate with the same energy behind itself through the wall on which that AP is) In this situation i can put this AP anywhere on the wall in the room and i can easily cover another room through one wall ... and between situation when AZ and EL pattern are reversed between self, so AZ is for vertical plane and EL is for horizontal plane. Because then this AP would only cover front direction and very weakly behind itself. And then i would need different type of AP for this project. ( any ceiling mounted AP like R310, R510 ... ). Michael, please could you give me clear answer for this? I don't have H510 in my LAB, only couple R510 and distributor hadn't H510 on the stock. About tips for H510 placement/best practices etc .. is up to you post some tips if you know any. If you could, then anybody can read in this topic an follow them. For sure i don't want that you would do anything in this project instead of me. Sorry for a long post. Thank You very much for your answer.

Re: Ruckus H510 antenna pattern and placement

michael_brado — Tue, 29 Aug 2017 17:40:08 GMT

Hello Luc,

I've spoken to our Indoor AP product line manager and obtained a slide from his
presentation. Due to our patented BeamFlex in addition to MU-MIMO capabilities,
the horizontal or vertical orientation of the H510 on your wall will not impact coverage.
They are designed for single room coverage, so cannot guarentee what connection
rates will be in the adjacent room behind the AP, if you place them in the middle,
between two rooms.

Re: Ruckus H510 antenna pattern and placement

shari_carroll_4 — Mon, 26 Feb 2018 19:25:39 GMT

Hi Michael, I have a question about the H510 installed in a room like shown below...

Will this hinder the signal and throughput for this room? It was originally requested that the AP be placed on the wall, but they changed at at the last minute and placed it here.

Re: Ruckus H510 antenna pattern and placement

ian_4265680 — Tue, 31 Jul 2018 17:31:36 GMT

That's going to be problematic for anyone below the base of the AP. Imagine the coverage as roughly a hemisphere. This is basically omni on the front, and little to no coverage to the rear. You *could* put it on a ceiling and get decent results.

Re: Ruckus H510 antenna pattern and placement

diego_garcia_de — Wed, 01 Aug 2018 01:11:47 GMT

Are you trying to cover the room next door? (behind the other wall?) its a bit tricky to know for sure.. Any client on " this" room (that can see the AP) should have no problem whatsoever with getting good coverage from this AP, unless its really high up in the ceiling and you're down below.. very close it it.

I regularly use the H510 and H320s and can cover almost 3 rooms with no problem in signal. Two rooms facing "forward" and one room facing backwards when the AP is mounted against a wall.

Re: Ruckus H510 antenna pattern and placement

chris_woodworth — Wed, 30 Oct 2019 21:45:06 GMT

We are deploying H510's in many of our projects and the Designers want to place the units behind the flat panel TV's. Is there a best practice around placement of AP behind case work and TV's from a performance perspective?

Re: Ruckus H510 antenna pattern and placement

ian_4265680 — Wed, 30 Oct 2019 21:50:34 GMT

As long as you account for the attenuation in your design and have a modicum of airflow around it there shouldn't be an issue, I have placed some behind bookcases and behind TVs without significant ill effects. In most use cases for these type of APs, you're running at low power anyway.

Re: Ruckus H510 antenna pattern and placement

chris_woodworth — Wed, 30 Oct 2019 22:00:57 GMT

Ian, thanks for the comments. We will be deploying the H510 along side an ONT to support our GPON network. Neither unit produces significant heat so we should be fine. I was more concerned about performance, we will be placing a AP per room in this project.

Re: Ruckus H510 antenna pattern and placement

michael_brado — Wed, 30 Oct 2019 22:03:25 GMT

Can you test it? I've seen TV/Video Screens that could affect RF and client throughput, and would recommend to not place the APs behind them... if other options are possible.

Re: Ruckus H510 antenna pattern and placement

chris_woodworth — Wed, 30 Oct 2019 22:09:10 GMT

Michael, Testing it in real world conditions today is not going to happen. I was looking for some use cases that would support this type of installation. I have placed the H510 successfully behind case work and concealed next to the FCU in the overhead, but never behind a flat panel TV.

Re: Ruckus H510 antenna pattern and placement

ian_4265680 — Thu, 31 Oct 2019 13:12:02 GMT

Chris, I wouldn't worry too much about it being behind the TV then - I've done a few deployments with Aruba's equivalent of these APs, and in such a small space to cover, the TV is not a significant factor (most TVs have an aluminum backplate to the display element, which will tend to reflect the signal rather than attenuate it.).

The key difference between the Aruba and the Ruckus (from an antenna propagation standpoint) is that the plastic mounting option behind the Aruba tends to provide more coverage behind the AP, whereas the metal plate on the Ruckus will make it more directional... although there's still a big heat sink on the Aruba, and any commercial setting will be mounting to metal boxes, so the difference is probably less pronounced.

Re: Ruckus H510 antenna pattern and placement

diego_garcia_de — Thu, 31 Oct 2019 13:19:15 GMT

Are you doing one per room or are there one every 2 rooms ?

I would try as much as possible to get the h510 "closer" to the edge of the TV. If it's a very large TV it could attenuate a fair bit.

Given you're using an ont (is this commscope fiber solution with power-over-fiber?) Do you need the additional Ethernet connectors of the h510? Cause maybe it might be more efficient to put an R320 for example of you don't need additional Ethernet connections and it can be powered by a simple 12v supply instead of 48v.

As for testing as Michael suggests maybe not real world conditions but at least try the AP behind a TV of similar size.